What’s good, y’all. You know, I just realized that I’ve been making blog postings at a decent rate so far in the month of March. Part of that is because I’ve been posting emails/comments from readers and haven’t had to think through responses for them, but it’s still good to be making regular updates. Plus, I’ve had much more time to just kick back and chill since starting my new job, which makes it a little easier to address reader emails…good thing too because my email backlog is ridiculous right now.
The message below is from a first-year MBA student who has been having some challenges in the summer internship recruiting process. Anyone who’s read my blog archives knows that I can completely identify with how this kid is feeling. I still shudder when I think back to how much it killed me to have companies diss me left and right. I recovered pretty well during the full-time cycle and this reader is looking for words of wisdom from me on how he might do the same thing. Let’s see if I can give him what he’s looking for…
—–
BH wrote:
“Hi there,
I came across several old post of yours from 2005 and 2006 in which you talked about your experiences with summer internship and also on your interview processes for full-time offer. It was extremely heartening and encouraging to hear how you managed to turn negative summer internship experience into a full time role with McKinsey post-MBA.
After having just received a dinged from McKinsey for the summer internship (MBA), I hope you can share with me how you managed to turn your negative experiences into a positive outcome as I too wish to learn from you and hope to turn my negative experience into a positive one.
What did you do differently the second time around during the case interviews? I have tried my hardest to prepare for the case interviews with McKinsey. I thought I did reasonably well and I got along with my 2 interviewers yet I still did not get past the 1st round for summer internship. Generic feedback given from HR was that I required too much prompting and I was not aggressive enough in laying down my structure.
I am new to the business world too, having spent 5 years in the government advising on energy policy. Hence the generic feedback given to me was indeed quite perplexing and not as constructive as I hope to receive. Can you shed some further light based on your past interview experiences?
Another side question which I have is: Will being rejected in the 1st round for summer internship hurt your chances for a full-time offer from McKinsey?
Looking forward to hearing from you.
Cheers,
BH”
—–
My response:
BH,
I hope this finds you doing well. Recently, I’ve found myself apologizing quite a bit for taking a while to respond to people and I should extend the same apology to you. You wouldn’t believe how many emails I have sitting in my blog Inbox right now. Since you’ve been waiting for a while, I hope you find this response somewhat helpful. After seeing your email, I had flashbacks from four years ago and I was being beaten down by all of the dings from my on-campus consulting interviews. That was such a trying time and I really let the disappointment of those failures destroy my confidence for a long time. Having gone through that, my first piece of advice for you is to do your best to shake off the disappointment of the McK ding and keep it moving. One firm turning you down doesn’t mean that you won’t get an internship. You’ll just have to go back to the drawing board to find something that’ll contribute to your learning over the summer and be fun for you at the same time. Easier said than done, right?…well, it may seem difficult now, but keep on trying and it’ll happen for you.
Let’s get to answering your primary question…”What did [I] do differently the second time around during the case interviews?”. The quick answer is that I did better on the interviews and got that daggone offer from McK, but that’s not very helpful, is it? hahahahahaha!
Seriously though, I did several things between the ding during the summer recruiting cycle and the successful full-time cycle. If you’ve read through my 2005 and 2006 posts as you said in your email, then you likely saw the link to the case prep guide that I wrote during my second year in business school (http://www.boomspeed.com/marquis930/Consulting_Case_Interview_Prep_Guide_-_v2.pdf). Well, I spent a lot of time doing a brain dump of my lessons learned on how to be successful at the consulting job search. I suggest you check out that file to find a detailed run-down of my advice on the topic. The following are a few quick highlights of my “Get my Consulting Game Right” strategy:
- Math tricks: During the internship cycle, I wasn’t great at doing the math quickly, so, while I could do it, I didn’t really feel comfortable going through it. To resolve that issue, I spent the Spring quarter of my MBA1 year and the summer teaching myself several helpful hints to make the case math easier for me. I wrote several slides in the case prep guide about this and have copied some of the tips below:
“- Use round numbers wherever you can, especially when you have the chance to pick the numbers
- Do “ballpark” calculations if possible
–> Often it isn’t about getting the exact mathematical response
–> Since there is usually some allowable margin of error, take advantage of that and “ballpark” whenever you can
- Don’t try to do calculations in your head unless you’re sure you can solve them correctly
–> When doing calculations in your head, be sure to write your solutions down so you can refer to them later
- Rule of 10’s and Rule of ½’s
–> Break difficult numbers into either tens or halves to do quicker calculations”
- Learning to “Think Business”: Several of the consulting firms that dinged me gave me feedback basically saying “we can tell that you’re smart, but you didn’t connect the dots well enough”. This made sense to me because I’d only had one quarter’s worth of MBA courses to that point and those courses were mostly quant in nature (i.e. didn’t really train me to analyze cases). I went into B-school with five years of Software Engineering experience, so I didn’t have a developed understanding of business by then. After figuring out that feedback, I came up with some exercises to teach myself to “think business” in hopes of better understanding the implications of different business moves and events. I wrote several slides about this in the case prep guide too, so I copied some of that content below…check out the link above for the full details:
“- Understanding the interrelations of players within and between industries is important to determining the implications of a business decision or event
- “Connecting the dots” in a business scenario should seem natural and almost second-nature during an interview
–> Difficulty in developing key business insights can indicate that a candidate may struggle on a consulting engagement
- Useful tactics for learning to “think business” include:
–> Reading business-related periodicals and websites, such as BusinessWeek, the Wall Street Journal, CNN Money, Yahoo! Finance, Fortune, etc.
–> Watching business-related television networks and shows, such as CNN Headline News, MSNBC, Bloomberg, etc.
–> When learning about recent business events, figure out the full set of implications of the event, both direct and indirect”
- Practice, practice, practice: The best way to become effective at consulting case interviews is to practice them as early and often and possible. In my case, I started reviewing case prep materials toward the beginning of Summer 2005 to sharpen my case game. One unexpected side effect of having been dissed by so many firms for internships is that I’d done well over 100 cases by the time my internship started, so these practices over the summer helped to keep my case game tight. The last thing you want to do is to start your case prep too late. If you don’t start on that until a week or two before the full-time cycle, then you’ll likely not do too well in the interviews.
- Be confident: This one is pretty self-explanatory. You’ve got to walk into those interviews feeling like you’ll do well on them. You need to believe that the job offer is yours for the taking and, if the companies choose to ding you, then know that it’s their loss. Looking back, my biggest weakness during the summer recruiting cycle was that I walked into my interviews terrified and thinking that I’d be a long-shot to win an offer. That was a deafeatist attitude that doomed me from the start without even knowing it. During the full-time cycle, I walked in knowing that I was qualified and that my case game was tight, so, if I didn’t do well, then it just wasn’t meant to be. I knew that the world wouldn’t end if I didn’t get the offer, which took a lot of pressure off of me. You might want to adopt that mindset in the fall when you step up to the plate again for another swing.
As for your last question, I honestly don’t know what kind of impact a first-round ding for the summer will have on your full-time recruiting (and I’m not trying to deflect your question). I believe that all depends on the company’s recruiting goals for a given school year, the recruiting team’s review of your resume, and the impressions you make during recruiting events. So, I’m not going to give you an answer on this one because I don’t want to risk being wrong in a few months when you go through the process again.
Take care and good luck on your summer internship search. Remember, no matter where you end up for the summer, be sure to get the most out of the experience and go back to school with your head held high for the ful-time recruiting cycle in the Fall.
-Marquis
The message below is from a first-year MBA student who has been having some challenges in the summer internship recruiting process. Anyone who’s read my blog archives knows that I can completely identify with how this kid is feeling. I still shudder when I think back to how much it killed me to have companies diss me left and right. I recovered pretty well during the full-time cycle and this reader is looking for words of wisdom from me on how he might do the same thing. Let’s see if I can give him what he’s looking for…
—–
BH wrote:
“Hi there,
I came across several old post of yours from 2005 and 2006 in which you talked about your experiences with summer internship and also on your interview processes for full-time offer. It was extremely heartening and encouraging to hear how you managed to turn negative summer internship experience into a full time role with McKinsey post-MBA.
After having just received a dinged from McKinsey for the summer internship (MBA), I hope you can share with me how you managed to turn your negative experiences into a positive outcome as I too wish to learn from you and hope to turn my negative experience into a positive one.
What did you do differently the second time around during the case interviews? I have tried my hardest to prepare for the case interviews with McKinsey. I thought I did reasonably well and I got along with my 2 interviewers yet I still did not get past the 1st round for summer internship. Generic feedback given from HR was that I required too much prompting and I was not aggressive enough in laying down my structure.
I am new to the business world too, having spent 5 years in the government advising on energy policy. Hence the generic feedback given to me was indeed quite perplexing and not as constructive as I hope to receive. Can you shed some further light based on your past interview experiences?
Another side question which I have is: Will being rejected in the 1st round for summer internship hurt your chances for a full-time offer from McKinsey?
Looking forward to hearing from you.
Cheers,
BH”
—–
My response:
BH,
I hope this finds you doing well. Recently, I’ve found myself apologizing quite a bit for taking a while to respond to people and I should extend the same apology to you. You wouldn’t believe how many emails I have sitting in my blog Inbox right now. Since you’ve been waiting for a while, I hope you find this response somewhat helpful. After seeing your email, I had flashbacks from four years ago and I was being beaten down by all of the dings from my on-campus consulting interviews. That was such a trying time and I really let the disappointment of those failures destroy my confidence for a long time. Having gone through that, my first piece of advice for you is to do your best to shake off the disappointment of the McK ding and keep it moving. One firm turning you down doesn’t mean that you won’t get an internship. You’ll just have to go back to the drawing board to find something that’ll contribute to your learning over the summer and be fun for you at the same time. Easier said than done, right?…well, it may seem difficult now, but keep on trying and it’ll happen for you.
Let’s get to answering your primary question…”What did [I] do differently the second time around during the case interviews?”. The quick answer is that I did better on the interviews and got that daggone offer from McK, but that’s not very helpful, is it? hahahahahaha!
Seriously though, I did several things between the ding during the summer recruiting cycle and the successful full-time cycle. If you’ve read through my 2005 and 2006 posts as you said in your email, then you likely saw the link to the case prep guide that I wrote during my second year in business school (http://www.boomspeed.com/marquis930/Consulting_Case_Interview_Prep_Guide_-_v2.pdf). Well, I spent a lot of time doing a brain dump of my lessons learned on how to be successful at the consulting job search. I suggest you check out that file to find a detailed run-down of my advice on the topic. The following are a few quick highlights of my “Get my Consulting Game Right” strategy:- Math tricks: During the internship cycle, I wasn’t great at doing the math quickly, so, while I could do it, I didn’t really feel comfortable going through it. To resolve that issue, I spent the Spring quarter of my MBA1 year and the summer teaching myself several helpful hints to make the case math easier for me. I wrote several slides in the case prep guide about this and have copied some of the tips below:
“- Use round numbers wherever you can, especially when you have the chance to pick the numbers
- Do “ballpark” calculations if possible
–> Often it isn’t about getting the exact mathematical response
–> Since there is usually some allowable margin of error, take advantage of that and “ballpark” whenever you can
- Don’t try to do calculations in your head unless you’re sure you can solve them correctly
–> When doing calculations in your head, be sure to write your solutions down so you can refer to them later
- Rule of 10’s and Rule of ½’s
–> Break difficult numbers into either tens or halves to do quicker calculations”
- Learning to “Think Business”: Several of the consulting firms that dinged me gave me feedback basically saying “we can tell that you’re smart, but you didn’t connect the dots well enough”. This made sense to me because I’d only had one quarter’s worth of MBA courses to that point and those courses were mostly quant in nature (i.e. didn’t really train me to analyze cases). I went into B-school with five years of Software Engineering experience, so I didn’t have a developed understanding of business by then. After figuring out that feedback, I came up with some exercises to teach myself to “think business” in hopes of better understanding the implications of different business moves and events. I wrote several slides about this in the case prep guide too, so I copied some of that content below…check out the link above for the full details:
“- Understanding the interrelations of players within and between industries is important to determining the implications of a business decision or event
- “Connecting the dots” in a business scenario should seem natural and almost second-nature during an interview
–> Difficulty in developing key business insights can indicate that a candidate may struggle on a consulting engagement
- Useful tactics for learning to “think business” include:
–> Reading business-related periodicals and websites, such as BusinessWeek, the Wall Street Journal, CNN Money, Yahoo! Finance, Fortune, etc.
–> Watching business-related television networks and shows, such as CNN Headline News, MSNBC, Bloomberg, etc.
–> When learning about recent business events, figure out the full set of implications of the event, both direct and indirect”
- Practice, practice, practice: The best way to become effective at consulting case interviews is to practice them as early and often and possible. In my case, I started reviewing case prep materials toward the beginning of Summer 2005 to sharpen my case game. One unexpected side effect of having been dissed by so many firms for internships is that I’d done well over 100 cases by the time my internship started, so these practices over the summer helped to keep my case game tight. The last thing you want to do is to start your case prep too late. If you don’t start on that until a week or two before the full-time cycle, then you’ll likely not do too well in the interviews.
- Be confident: This one is pretty self-explanatory. You’ve got to walk into those interviews feeling like you’ll do well on them. You need to believe that the job offer is yours for the taking and, if the companies choose to ding you, then know that it’s their loss. Looking back, my biggest weakness during the summer recruiting cycle was that I walked into my interviews terrified and thinking that I’d be a long-shot to win an offer. That was a deafeatist attitude that doomed me from the start without even knowing it. During the full-time cycle, I walked in knowing that I was qualified and that my case game was tight, so, if I didn’t do well, then it just wasn’t meant to be. I knew that the world wouldn’t end if I didn’t get the offer, which took a lot of pressure off of me. You might want to adopt that mindset in the fall when you step up to the plate again for another swing.
As for your last question, I honestly don’t know what kind of impact a first-round ding for the summer will have on your full-time recruiting (and I’m not trying to deflect your question). I believe that all depends on the company’s recruiting goals for a given school year, the recruiting team’s review of your resume, and the impressions you make during recruiting events. So, I’m not going to give you an answer on this one because I don’t want to risk being wrong in a few months when you go through the process again.
Take care and good luck on your summer internship search. Remember, no matter where you end up for the summer, be sure to get the most out of the experience and go back to school with your head held high for the ful-time recruiting cycle in the Fall.
-Marquis
